https://www.sup.org/books/title/?id=27959
Hazal Corak: Waste Siege focuses on multiple forms of waste which accumulate and assume political status in Palestine. It introduces us to waste professionals who design landfills, ethical anxieties about unwanted bread, and Palestine’s flea (rabish) markets where objects that are discarded by their previous users in Israel are given second lives. Still, I am wondering what happens to the valuables that Palestinians discard. Take, for instance, the construction waste and objects such as metal scrap which retain economic value despite their discarded status. Given the sanctions and limitations towards the Palestinian Authority, are these re-introduced into global markets by Israeli companies and authorities? Who profits? What sort of economics and politics of waste-ownership are at stake in Palestine when it comes to such discarded valuables?
Sophia Stamatopoulou-Robbins: Shuqba village offers us a telling case. Palestinian hospitals from the Ramallah area send x-ray films to Shuqba to be burned down for their silver. We can assume that the x-ray films’ pathway goes something like this: Ramallah hospital, truck to Shuqba, arrangement with a Shuqba landowner who allows dumping on his land, burning to extract silver, silver sale to someone presumably outside Shuqba, possibly in Israel, melting of that silver (again) to turn it into something else, sale of that object, and so on. Data on how much cash is exchanged and where it ends up would offer a fuller sense of the political economy of waste in this settler colonial context. I heard stories of Israeli mafia connections to certain Palestinian discards like bottles. Other Palestinian discards may “leak” through into Israel or go farther afield. But other questions offer other, equally useful, insights. For example, some people, processes, or systems benefit indirectly from the revaluation of wastes. Understanding them is a way to understand how accumulations produce conditions of possibility for world-making. For example, Ramallah-area medical wastes supposedly disappearing into Shuqba allows the Palestinian Authority not to have to worry about increasing the management needs of those landfills, which means increased costs and scrutiny from Israeli actors, international donors, and local communities. It allows people in the villages around Jenin’s Zahrat al-Finjan landfill, whose land was taken by it, to feel slightly more secure that groundwater is not contaminated by hospital wastes and perhaps to tolerate the landfill despite its odors. It likely extends the landfill’s lifespan, and perhaps the lifespans of landfills in Palestine more broadly, which has its own implications. Smoke puffing out of a Palestinian village allows Israeli government officials to confirm that Israeli interventions on Palestinians’ waste management is necessary for the common good. A Palestinian truck driver who makes $40 to haul wastes from al-Hilal hospital near al-‘Amari refugee camp, like the Shuqba landowner who receives a similar sum to allow the dumping, does not exactly profit from that act even if a few paper bills make their way into his pocket. Settler colonialism and racism do profit, on the other hand, even if the flows of money to their primary supporting institutions (such as the military) are not so easily apparent. Comparing the “profiteers” and the processes and affects that gain their conditions of possibility makes visible that it is equally or even more important to follow paths less direct than the financial outcomes of circulations. Sometimes the interests of the people who profit are not served by that profiting in the long-term.
Hazal Corak: Rabish goods, namely the secondhand items that travel from Israel to Palestine, evoke contradictory emotions and senses of the self among buyers and sellers alike. As you report, they open up imaginaries about the contemporary life in the ancestral lands that are now out of reach to many. They create intimacy with and humanize the colonizer. Yet, using them also elicits senses of humility, lack, and embarrassment. The notion of shame has historically held a central place in the ethnographies of the Middle East and the Mediterranean. As Andrew Shryock remarks (2019), this notion is making a fresh return after almost three decades of abandonment. What sort of intersubjective relations of not only shame but also shaming are at work in your interlocutors’ engagement with rabish and waste? In what ways does the Waste Siege participate in such regional debates in the anthropology of the Middle East and the Mediterranean?
Sophia Stamatopoulou-Robbins: I understand shame in the honor-shame dyad in structuralist framings of the Middle East and Mediterranean to describe a sense applying simultaneously to a group and an individual. In this it resonates with the kind of shame that some people felt in Jenin, for example, when they worried about it being known that they shopped in the rabish. The shame was my friend Dana’s when I mistakenly asked her too loudly on the street whether we were going the rabish that day. Her face went hot with fear that we had been overheard. It was also a classed shame, forging a connection to her working class status that her family was trying to escape. It was a national shame stemming from humiliation she and others experienced at the thought that Israel as a society was dumping its discards on Palestinians as a society. One difference is the fact that rabish shame was understood as a failing, yes, but less as a moral failing (which is pronounced in the honor-shame dyad) and more as a failing to have prevented the harm in which one lives. It is helpful to understand it as political shame, implying knowledge of an otherwise not accessed—whether that otherwise is found in histories of collective rebellion like that which occurred in the two intifadas or in a decision to resist wanting the goods Israelis discard across the Green Line. Even if other paths not taken (rebellion, nondesire) are implicitly superior to the one taken (buying colonial discards), honor is not the term that best characterizes their superiority. The honor-shame dyad has been used to offer what were understood to be cultural explanations for why people made some decisions and not others, why fathers killed their daughters and families feuded. The shame I witnessed, mixed as it was with desire, playfulness, ambivalence, historicity, and pragmatism, was neither pure as a structure of feeling nor cultural in the sense that it somehow existed before or outside of politics, for example in the form of occupation or history. It was an interpretation of one’s gendered, classed, and political location in the world and in relation to past and future.
Hazal Corak: I would like to go back to the very beginning of the book in order to touch upon some theoretical implications of how waste siege works and what it does. In the introduction, you distinguish between experiential and structural forms of violence. Can you tell us some more about how you see the distinction between the two and in what ways the waste siege is specifically facilitating an experiential form of violence rather than a structural one?
Sophia Stamatopoulou-Robbins: Living in Palestine made me curious about the discrepancy between what people sensed about waste and how they understood accountability and politics in relation to waste. I was puzzled that, on the one hand, waste was so pervasive in the spaces that Palestinians traversed daily that it seemed impossible not to sense it through one’s body. People did sense it in that they closed taxi windows as they passed sewage-saturated valleys. Shopkeepers swept incessantly in front of shops. People cursed the cheaply made objects like toasters that broke during use and made connections between their miscarriages and the dumps smoldering around their villages. Yet somehow this inundation by waste often obscured what I would describe as the structural violence that was its condition of possibility. Waste was irritating, confounding, worrying, generating of endless attempts to manage it. But something about it created a kind of noise in the signal that makes clear to Palestinians that settler colonialism, for example, is to blame for other experiences like a house demolition. Each time I traced the origins and flows of waste I found connections to the Palestinian Authority’s vision of a capitalist Palestinian future state, or to Israeli efforts to settle the West Bank, for example. But these connections were not as visible to the person whose lungs were clenching from trash fire smoke or to the person smelling sewage and who was stuck—and this is the crucial point—in Palestine. Accountability was shrugged off as opaque, if often still related to the general situation, meaning occupation (al-wadi’). Or it was attributed to poor management (on the part of the PA) or irresponsibility (on the part of a neighbor). Political analysis brought into so many other conversations about life in Palestine did not often extend to what I call waste siege. One of the goals of the book was to try to name this thing that was not named as a siege, to gather many disparate experiences together and give them a name. Another goal was to suggest that there are sieges that can be felt and cause suffering while differing in significant ways from the sieges that provoke mass mobilization, which this siege has thus far not done.
Hazal Corak In the book you mention your stay at an Israeli-owned AirBnB in Palestine. Your next project is on AirBnB rentals in Palestine and Greece. Can you tell us a little bit about how your research on waste infrastructures in Palestine led to this second project? What sort of similar themes attract your attention and in what ways is this one a completely novel endeavor for you?
Sophia Stamatopoulou-Robbins: My next book explores the effects on property, family, and forms of attachment that have resulted from the saturation of Athens (Greece) with Airbnbs under austerity. My work overall seeks to answer two main questions: 1) How do destructive conditions—be they ecological, political, or economic—remake socialities and relations? 2) And how do people harness the material and semiotic properties of infrastructures to make their everyday lives livable under conditions of duress? In each of my projects I locate large-scale phenomena such as settler colonialism and austerity in the intimate details that emerge from slow ethnographic listening. Paying attention to quotidian details allows us to see how destructive conditions become braided into people’s senses of ethics, self, and possibilities for alternative futures. Palestine and post-2009 Greece have more in common than meets the eye. Both are places of foreign occupation. The forms of violence vary. But foreign states and agencies are the main determinants of the destructive conditions in which the people in both places live.
An empirical question that had come up during my work on Waste Siege was about less visible strategies people in the broader geographies of Israel/Palestine were using to mitigate besieging circumstances. One answer I found was that many Israelis and Palestinians are investing in Athens real estate. This led me to spend time in Greece with Israelis who traveled back and forth between Athens and Israel facilitating investments in Athens properties and it sent me back to Israel/Palestine for a new bout of fieldwork starting in 2020.
Middle class Israelis and Palestinians will look to secure their futures against potential war and economic crisis, and to boost chances of upward mobility through expensive European educations for their children, and so are investing outside their political borders. There is a sense that there is less and less land available to build upon, which is a condition of waste siege, and this has been an important driver of investment abroad. Palestinians’ experiences of discriminatory landownership further contribute to overcrowding in Palestinian towns like Reineh in northern Israel, where I spent time with a family of Palestinian investors in 2020. One of the attractions of Athenian apartments for foreign investors is that they can easily be turned into Airbnbs with high annual returns. Between 2010, when Airbnb had first arrived in Greece, and 2019, the number of listings jumped from a few dozen to over 91,000.
For Greek as well as foreign owners, Airbnb is an improvisation for mitigating destructive conditions. I call the relationship calibration to which Airbnb has contributed “controlled alienation.” That is the process of, on the one hand, letting go of aspects of existing relationships, ways of being and thinking that are made in relation to homes. And, on the other hand, maintaining some ability to determine the fate or workings of things. These two processes are conditions of one another. For example: a family of property owners I call the Petridous were able to maintain legal ownership of the apartment by giving up use of it (to Airbnb managers) for themselves. I think of controlled alienation as a way of managing the violence of austerity as siege. By offering stays as short as one night and flexible booking and cancelation, Airbnb allows owners to feel that they can return to their space at will. But this preserving does not achieve continuity. Nor does it cleanly replace one body (the now deregulated state) with another (a multibillion dollar company). In the process of engaging with the platform, people lose some things and gain others. My book tries to capture the sensibility that emerges in that dual loss and gain.
Side note: I have only stayed in Airbnbs within Palestinian cities run by Palestinians or jointly run by Palestinians and their expat spouses.
Hazal Corak: Finally, I want to ask about the issue of multi-sitedness in relation to the Waste Siege and your research on the AirBnB rentals. In the book we see you present at the Palestinian households, flea markets, bureaucrats’ offices, and landfills as well as the meetings with NGOs and environmentalists in Israel. Do you see the Waste Siege as a multi-sited ethnography? How do you compare the structures of multi-sitedness in your two different projects? Multi-sited research is seen crucial due to the polycentric workings of the global economy and the planetary proceedings of the ecological crisis. At times, it is also criticized for being too ambitious as an ethnographic endeavor. What would you like to share with other ethnographers regarding methods, techniques, and terms of getting related to multiple settings which constitute the different ends of one single phenomenon?
Sophia Stamatopoulou-Robbins: A project on almost anything must be mobile. The idea of the single-sited project implies a site that is somehow ontologically bounded. As anthropologists we create the sites we claim to study by naming and reifying them in our work. The relative boundedness of any site is contested both by those in it and by those who (also) produce knowledge about it. Major elisions result from imagining a site as supposedly purely itself. Take Psari, the village in which my grandfather was born. Home to about 385 registered people (not including myself, my parents, or my nuclear family, though we have a family house there), the village of Psari is located two hours west of Athens. I would miss a lot if I were to assume that I could physically stay within the boundaries of Psari, nestled in the mountains, to understand how people experience life there. I would miss that most of the women marry in from regions as far away as Epirus. I would miss the uncounted Roma communities who pass through, the Bengali workers who sleep outside on the hills but who work the land as cheap labor, I would miss the hundreds of children, elders, and deceased self-identified members of Psari’s community disbursed in Australia and Chicago. I would miss the global swirl of private housing and anti-Communism campaigns that historian Nancy Kwak has documented and that sent American funds for homes to be rebuilt after German soldiers burned Psari down during World War II. I might miss the fact that Konstantinos Tsamados, a fourteen-year-old from a modest family, is a Youtube sensation for his incredible voice. I might miss the fact that the waters in Psari’s rocky underground—waters Psari needs to support its one economic engine, agriculture—are being pumped by private companies, with government permission, bottled and shipped to Saudi Arabia. Whether you want to study gender, class, environmental politics, or media in Psari, you would have to use some sort of multi-sitedness to do it. We have been multi-sited all along.
In studying Airbnbs, I did something similar to what I did in studying waste in Palestine. I paid attention to flows of materials, ideas, and people. Those of us who followed the network have learned that the network is endless and rhizomatic. There are only so many threads one can follow in a finite amount of time, with one body and a desire to do more than prove that things exist in networks. I think they do, and I think that many people have made the case compellingly. Within the finitude of our lives we can dig deeper into particular relations. In studying Airbnb in Athens, I learned about investors buying Airbnbs who were based in several countries including China, Russia, Egypt, Turkey, and Israel/Palestine. I followed the thread that led me back to Israel/Palestine because I knew that I was better able to say something about the worlds out of which those investors were coming, about the conditions of possibility and structures of feeling that supported the investments, and about what the investments did for investors from Israel/Palestine in return. My choice does not suggest that there is something more interesting about this investment pathway than about the pathway that leads Russians or Turks to invest in Athens; rather, it suggests that I can be more interesting in relation to this pathway than I can in relation to others. My advice would be to pursue the relations that are most obscured from public view.